🚀 go-pugleaf

On Wednesday, July 17, 2019 at 9:16:25 PM UTC, Will Dockery wrote:
> Did you ever review this episode, Nancy G?

NancyGene - 3/7/18
Below are our impressions of the interview Will Dockery did with local artist Charles Fowler.  
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hHWM3xu9I0w&t=10s (running time 25:40)

Visuals:
Will is noticeably more gray/white haired in this video for some reason. We are not sure if it is the setting and lighting or he is just older here—we surmise it is the latter.  The location is the artist’s studio, and the background has a crumpled paper fragment pinned to the wall and some other paper (calendar page?) stuck there.  A cement block wall on the left makes it look like it was filmed in the men’s bathroom.  Charles Fowler has on jeans, a checkered shirt and a sports coat.  Will has on sunglasses, a black shirt (top 3 buttons unbuttoned) and jeans.  Fowler is an earnest-looking short-bearded and mustached young man.  Will uses a hand mic, and they are both sitting on chairs, with the camera aimed above the waist.

00.19:  Will:  “Hello, welcome back to Kaleidoscope, the show where we cover, just, all the artists of the Chattahoochee Valley.  Sooner or later we are going to get to all artists and all mediums.  Today we have Charles Fowler, uh, va, uh, hmm, very, lots of different influences with Charles.”  (Charles looks incredulously at the camera and nods.)  “I’d say everything from surrealism to Dadaism, to maybe comic books, but anyway, I’ve known Charles since he was a wee tyke but I don’t really know that much about you, and they want to know about you.”  (Charles tries to take the mic and Will holds onto it.  (00.59)  Charles finally gets a chance to talk at this point.

01:20 – Will waves his hands around.  Will:  “Um, one of the questions I like to ask is what do you think was the catalyst, the spark, that caused you to realize that you’ve got to manifest this vision.”  (Will hands over the mic at 01:42.)  Charles’ father is evidently into music and drums and “illustrates things on the side”.  His grandmother is a painter, Mary Lockwood.  

02:44:  Will says, “We’ll have to get her on the show” and points to the camera.  There is talk about Charles doing other things but determined to become an artist.  03:41:  Will gets back the mic.  “Well, you can definitely say that the family dynasty kind of like, sort of like, determined that for you, in a way, the genes.  Uh, I, uh, I remember your grandmother’s art and [Will makes a circle of his pointer finger and thumb] , a lot of album covers…and I see that influence now, it rings a bell with me.”  Will opens and closes his fingers.  Charles looks really bored while Will talks and gestures.  

At 04:36, some dot illustrations are shown.  Some “art” is shown on the screen but it’s not clear whose these are, since they are talking about Charles’ father, grandmother, and him.  05:25:  Will says, “Yeah, he’s, that situationalist of, that’s where I got the multi-media, it’s a visual, sound, vision, it’s basically you’re working towards the entire package, in other words, in a lot of ways, and that’s sort of the tradition that your family carries [Will makes a fist] of the complete package, I’m thinking, right?”  Will waves his arms around.  

Charles says he does art of the mundane and absurdities.  05:49, while Charles is talking, Will brushes his hair back with his hands, adjusts his glasses, wipes his eyebrows, lifts up his shirt by the collar, then looks at the camera, looks down, and purses his lips.  He does not look at his guest.  

Charles evidently does performance art.  At 06:20, there is a video showing him holding onion halves under his eyes.  “Test the limits of the viewer or myself.”  “It seems to be mostly so far about endurance and uh, just sort of playing a joke on the viewer and sometimes myself.”  Our endurance was certainly tested, and we didn’t get the joke.  

06:37:  Will:  “Uh, Marcel Duchamp [Will pronounces it Marcel Dew Camp], Andy Warhol, 8 hours of the Empire State Building, uh, and uh, I love pets, I’m noticing your little pup here. [Papier-mâché (?)  Dachshund on the floor]   Ah, but, yeah, anyway.” [Charles reaches for the mic to comment but Will doesn’t give it over to him].  Will continues to talk.  

Will:  “You were born about what year, 1980, something or other [Charles says 1988] and the influence of Columbus, uh, I know, I know the influence of Columbus, they know the influence of Columbus, the influence of Columbus probably gave you some sort of a different…like you were talking about the Goetchius House, uh…”

The Kaleidoscope logo is in the background, but what you see is “KALE” and “SCOP” on the screen.

At 11:26, Will and Charles are standing.  Charles has taken off his coat.  Will:  “…local artist of many mediums and media, and he is going to show us some of his present day work, and this appears to be a triptych of some kind.”  (There are 2 masks, one mint colored and one reddish, that are on pedestals.)  Charles:  “Casts of myself, my head.” Made of plaster.  “My head semi deflated, it’s called.”  “My head with a resting sculpture.  It’s weighing down, pushing into my head.”  

Skipping a bunch of twaddle about heads.

13:37:  Will, “And there’s obvious symbolisms that you can, as is with art, and a lot of it is what the person brings to it.  And I’m definitely knowing the ins and outs, I’m seeing a lot of symbolism here, a lot of in humor.  Anyway, uh, yeah, go ahead.”  

Charles:  “I didn’t realize it until just now, I have, uh, you know, red, white and blue and that could be just a response, like an artist response to many things.  I think I’m responding to being American, the idea of what it, you know, like lately the elections, and just the sense of, uh, love for America I’ve been having and I think, I don’t know why, red, white and blue to stick in here.  So something I just noticed.”  [There are 3 pedestals, two about the same height and one about 1/3 the height.  They each have a face mask on the top.]

14:13:  Will, “In a way I’m catching, like, the responsibilities of being an American and these are [waves hands] the three phases of Americana.  But, yes (Will gives a thumbs up sign), American artists.”  “Uh, the bicycle, is this yours?”  [We can’t understand what Charles says because Will has the mic, but evidently it isn’t.]  14:36:  Shows a pink kiddie bike with a jacket draped over the handle bars.  Will, “(ha, hah, ha,) Oh, okay, I thought it was a piece of sculpture.”  Will:  “Okay, Charles shares a studio with a couple of other artists who we will probably get to in future episodes.”  Will points and then points to something off camera, “Like this sculpture behind here, I’d like to cover that artist soon.”  [Why bring up someone else when he is interviewing this artist?]  

14:41:  Will:  “But this is, getting to a point, though, is that there’s a big show with a lot of artists coming up, like real soon [points to the camera], and we were gonna get you to talk about that [Will still has the mic] and a lot of these artists you see sharing this studio in the Corn Center [aptly named] will be there.  I’ll let you take it away and tell us about that.”  (Will hands the mic to Charles.)  Charles:  “Okay, well, what he’s referring to is the Columbus State University Senior Artists Exhibition, basically our last show as seniors, because I’m a graduating senior and, um, it’s gonna be an exhibit, uh, with 13 talented artists all doing a range of different things, uh, technology, dealing with the identity, with the self or with society, uh, and it’s many different things and, um, it’s going to be in December, you can find out at the Columbus University website.  [Shown on the screen is the CSU website but there is nothing on there about an art show.]

15:40:  Will:   “As far as yourself, uh, you have anything else coming up in recent times, uh, I know we’ve missed a couple [Will makes a circle with his first finger and thumb], but basically the art just continues to flow, you’re getting ready to graduate, and we’ll, we’ll discuss that shortly. But, okay.”  [Charles makes a gesture of reaching for the mic but covers that by stroking his mustache when Will doesn’t give him the mic.]

16:02:  Will points to the screen, “We’re gonna take a little quick break here.”  Every time Charles thinks he is going to get the mic to say something, he reaches but Will doesn’t give it to him so he touches his face, mouth, moustache, or nose instead to cover for the gesture.)  “and be back in a couple of minutes.  We’re gonna sell a few items here, you stay tuned and we’re gonnna be back with Charles Fowler in just a few moments.  Thank you.”  [From 15:44 to 16:12, Will has talked without giving Charles a chance to say anything.]

17:06:  Will is on the screen, “Welcome to Kaleidoscope, this is Will Dockery, and we have Charles Fowler, oh this isn’t Charles, this is Charles’ likeness coming out of a pedestal [mic to the blue mask].  We have Charles Fowler here, local artist, and these are, like I was saying, these are sort of a variation on the death mask I think.  So these are actually your face. “ [Hands Charles the mic., the screen shows a head with a spike coming out of its eye.]  Charles, “Uh, yeah, um, it’s, I guess, just the idea of immortalization, immortalizing yourself or just capturing, uh, a moment in my life, which was a 20 minute moment casting my head.”

17:47:  Will: “As we discussed this earlier, uh, I know that me and my director have, is that really, uh, that’s a lot of the, uh, the motivation of most artists, I think you will probably agree, is that creating art is your bid for immortality.  It’s like this is going to be around for a long time.”  18:09:  Charles: “I think anyone who’s creative wants to have this ability to stay thought of, because as time passes by, you know, you’re not going to be immortal forever, because [18:25 there is much mic static]  like, say the Beatles will no longer be mentioned, probably, in 200 years because we’ll have a new Beatles, you know.  Infamous or controversy, I know, controversial, um, but, yeah, this is a strive [sic] to immortalize myself, uh, through, I guess art, music or whatever I do, you know.”  [Hands mic to Will.]

18:50:  Will:  “Interesting point you got there.  That is a question that we’ve often wondered about, folks from our generation, we wonder, we saw, oh, yeah, the Shakespeare phenomenon, it’s like 500 years later and people still remember Shakespeare, uh, barely [Will makes a finger and thumb circle] but they still do, they know his quotes, so the question is, will the Beatles really, really become that level or not and whether this will or not, this is your bid for mortality [sic]; it’s our bid as artists.  [Shows picture of a Dollar Store on the screen for some reason.]  It’s like since we climbed up and started doing cave etchings, it’s like trying to leave something behind, isn’t it.”  [Will is still talking up to 19:30.]  Will hands Charles the mic and looks down at the ground, then walks around while Charles is talking.  

19:35:  Charles: “Yeah, it’s always that documentation that you always want to leave, the imprint of yourself on this earth forever how long it will last, um, yeah.”

 Will:  “And, we’re here at the future and it’s interesting that’s what we’re talking about, where do you see yourself 20 years from now?”  19:56:  Charles:  “I hopefully see myself, probably, uh, up north or somewhere where art is like, you know, uh, flourishing, you know, but I also see myself as a musician.”  [hmm]  [Will raises his fingers.]  “So I hope to see myself performing and doing things and or just try to stay creative and try to find new outlets of life you know, even if I don’t do art forever, I hope to do something that will help me, you know, grow as a human being.”  [Gives the mic to Will.]

20:30:  Will:  “Uh, it’s interesting that we have, he’s also a musician as much as the Echo Beast, the other project that you’ve got, uh, maybe you might mention, uh, tell us about the music a little, huh?”  [Will points, fingers together, looks at camera.]

20:48:  Charles:  “Uh, yeah, my music I, well, collaborate with my father with a number of different, uh, projects, but I also do, uh, you know, solo work, and I also draw influence from, say, the 70s , uh, sort of like the beginning of electronics or, uh, more of an ambient feel of music but still have this uh, rock steady element to it where it’s sort of poppy but it’s not pop because, because, there’s a lot of thought to it.  You know, I’m trying to play the different sounds like Kraut Rock from Germany, uh, I just want to constantly try to find ways to evolve music by looking to the past.  It’s like I do with my art, I look to the past and then I try to find a way to either carry a conversation or, uh, change it.”

21:41:  Will:  “And your music can be found on YouTube, uh, um, name a key word or two besides Charles Fowler, there’s also, yeah, Mammoth Camp, Echo Beast, tell us about it.” <SNIP>

22:03 <SNIP>  Charles: “…and sometimes I just collaborate with many different artists musicians, ‘cause, you know, there’s tons of different sounds out there.  You’ve got to hear it all, is what I say.”

22:50:  Will:  “The future [Will spins his arm around]. Okay, we asked about 20 years in the future, how about 2 months in the future?”  [Charles reaches for the mic but Will doesn’t give it to him, so Charles pulls his hand back to his chest.]  Charles: “I hope to graduate or be graduated [there is a garbage can in the background],< ….> and I plan on just keep trying  to find new places to show my talent, my art, my music wherever I can find it and hopefully check out new cities and get in more experience so that it can influence, uh, what I do.”

23:25:  Will:  “And that brings me around to where people can find you [waves his hands around].  Wherever you’re at they can find you on the Internet, where…”  While Charles is talking, Will points down and spins his hand around, bringing attention to himself.  Will also puffs out his chest.  At 24:14, Will looks 180 degrees away from Charles while he is talking.

24:29:  Will:  “We see all sorts of influences coming up and stuff.”  “We got Charles Fowler [Will looks away, 180 degrees, down and not at Charles].  “Uh, we hope to have you back, as they said in the Star Trek episode “Space Seed”, we would like to come back in 6 months and see what has spring up  [Will wiggles his fingers up and still holds the mic] from the mind of Charles Fowler.” The mask and some junk is shown in the background, and the camera is on Will only.

24:49:  Will:  “This is Kaleidoscope, I’m Will Dockery, we’re gonna be back next week with more art.  I don’t know about art you don’t know about art, and that’s why we have people like Charles Fowler to explain it to us.”  Will points to Charles, points the mic at him, and Charles says, “Uh, thank you.”  Will:  “Thank you, points to camera, we’ll see you next week.”

The closing credits have what looks like one and then two cucumbers or beans on a table that we never saw before.  We are not sure what art this symbolized unless it is Charles’ seed.

Overall impressions:

Will talks way too much during this interview, not giving his guest enough time to talk.  There are several times when it would have been a natural progression for Charles to have talked, and Charles did reach for the mic, but Will did not yield it.  

Will doesn’t know what etchings are.  He frequently gets to the end of a sentence and has lost his original thought (see the comment on Shakespeare and the Beatles).  Will doesn’t know the difference between mortality and immortality.  

We didn’t get any sense of Charles being talented in art, since we only saw the 3 masks and a couple of screen shots of performance art.  We don’t know if he can draw or paint or exactly why he thinks he will be able to support himself as an artist.  We didn’t see anything there that anyone would buy.  Also, he has the well-known fault of youth of “hoping” things will happen, and not the practicality of how this is going to translate into making a living.  Starving artists may want to look back on their life decisions.

Charles mentions exploring other cities than Columbus, which is shorthand for getting the hell out of that hick town as soon as he graduates.  We see that he is still there and curating some art exhibit at the university, so not sure what happened to that.  

The epiphany that we had:  Will sees immortality through his myriad posts, his countless “poems”, whatever medium he can use.  He wants to be remembered, and it doesn’t really make any difference to him how, or whether what he does is good or not.  If his name is there, it’s all good.  Will probably has a call into Egypt about future mummification.  

Suggestions:  Will should dress in at least a business casual fashion instead of bum light.  He should familiarize himself with the guest’s work so that can be showcased.  The scenes should be framed more professionally, so that garbage cans and oddities are not included.  He needs to let the guest talk instead of featuring himself--a good interviewer makes the guest look good.